Tori Tsui Tells Us It’s Not Just You

Mixed Asian Media - August 15, 2023

By Erica Ito

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The introduction of activist Tori Tsui’s debut book — It’s Not Just You: How to Navigate Eco-Anxiety and the Climate Crisis — reads, “If it weren’t for the fact that the word ‘climate’ has become the face of this multifaceted issue, I’d choose to call it the ‘result- of-ALL-systems-of-oppression’ crisis, but ‘climate’ crisis has a better ring to it.” As a full-time environmental advocate, Tsui’s unique approach to the climate justice movement brings mental health to the forefront. We caught her for a conversation about her work, and how her childhood in Hong Kong shaped her international advocacy today. If you aren’t already aware of Tsui’s incredible presence on this earth, it is my privilege to share this conversation with you.

To start off, tell me more about the title, which I believe has multiple meanings?

Yeah! It's Not Just You has many meanings and I think that really lends itself to the narrative and the progress of the book. It starts off simply by saying that anyone who is experiencing any hardships in relation to the climate crisis, specifically with their mental health, is not alone. It's a very real reaction to what are incredibly unnatural circumstances that are happening to the planet. I like to reaffirm that at its most fundamental level, it's a reminder that there is community in a lot of this struggle, and then it breaks away from that by also reminding us that our perspectives don't speak for everyone.

It's Not Just You is also a call to arms for intersectionality and understanding the climate crisis with an emphasis in particular on racial justice and how important that is in the climate conversation. 

Then its third iteration is: it's not just you, there are very specific systems that are creating a crisis of the climate and the mental health crisis as well. It's really important to understand how these systems — knowledge systems, socioeconomic systems, systems of oppression — are causing the crisis as we know it. 

Then it ties it all together in a neat little bow by encouraging us to be in community. It's not just you. We've gotta turn ourselves toward one another ’cause that's how we create change in society.

You grew up in a fishing village in Hong Kong where your day-to-day life was affected by extreme weather events like typhoons, which stirred eco-anxiety from a young age. I'm curious what other early feelings and values from your upbringing in this particular community do you carry with you into your work today?

It's really interesting because insofar as climate activism in the mainstream media, you don't really see that many East and Southeast Asian climate activists taking up space. I'm hoping that some of the narratives from my childhood encourage people to also step forward and talk about how their cultures and their livelihoods also inform their activism. 

For me, I think there's a misconception with Hong Kong that it's just this super built-up city, that all it is is just like, hustle-and-grind 24/7. But I grew up in the countryside by a fishing town, and that exposed me to a plethora of different natural habitats and environmental ecosystems that I'm so grateful for. Because without that, I don't think I'd have nearly enough of a strong connection to and love for the natural world as I do now.

The eco-anxiety aspect is very much a real part of that journey. But so is the love that I had for my childhood home. It's a lot harder to fight for something if you don't love it, right? So I feel very grateful to have grown up in that environment.

You’ve spoken about how your perspective on and pathways for activism shifted when you moved from Hong Kong to the U.K. And your book intentionally features advice from environmental advocates around the world. What's something about championing for climate justice that you wish you knew as a kid growing up in Hong Kong?

One thing that I wish I knew — that I would love for other Asian youth to know — is that our cultures hold the keys to our success.

With the way that the mainstream environmental movement is portrayed, it's very European, very white. That often leads to this misconception that our communities just don't care about these things. But if I’m gonna use a really simple anecdote, my mom has been reusing a reusable bag before it was even trendy. 

She would use those plastic Tupperware things until they literally disintegrate. She was like the queen of sustainability, but it didn't have the name “sustainability.” When we're kids, we're just like, “Oh, mom, don't do that!” 

And now I'm actually like, “You know what? I freaking love you for that.” I think for a lot of Asian kids, they're told that they don't have a space in this movement and I'm just here to proclaim, “No. Trust me, there's a space for everyone.”

Our perspectives are super important and it's imperative that we all take a stand because a lot of East and Southeast Asian homelands are most vulnerable to the climate crisis. And if we don't fight for them, then nobody else will.

Yeah! You write in It’s Not Just You’s “Note for the Reader,” “I imagine that some of the words in this book may prompt discomfort and disagreement. I encourage you to sit with these feelings, mull them over. Write them down and then find ways to let them inspire you. No change in society has ever been achieved without discomfort. It is one of the best gifts we have for furthering our practice.” Are there ways that you feel living as a mixed person has given you a sort of comfort with discomfort?

Definitely. Especially as someone who's mixed-race Asian, there's a lot of what I navigate, which is constant discomfort. I think we exist as a bit of a paradox because to my white peers, I'm not white, but to other people of color… Sometimes East and Southeast Asian people are left out of the conversation and I'm not seen as [a person] of color even though I'm not racialized as white.

My community certainly experiences a lot of racism, so much so that it goes under the radar because people don't take it seriously, and I feel like that discomfort comes from feeling never really part of any one community. And so through that discomfort I've learned how to take up more space and actually advocate for my community and be like, “No, no, no. We are here. There are different struggles that we experience and we have just as much right as anybody else to take up space and talk about our stories and our solutions.”

When I wrote that particular excerpt, I was really trying to lean into people in the climate space who get uncomfortable when it comes to talking about racial injustice.

Yes! 

Especially folks from the global North who may not have necessarily experienced any other existential hardships specifically related to racism or gender inequality or ableism. Those who fall in the sort of category of being the most privileged. That specific line is really about making sure that people who are going in with that perspective know that they're gonna be challenged and that's OK.

Because anyone who's undergone any form of struggle has found tools and ways to navigate that. People develop forms of resilience. And I don't wanna glamorize this, like, toxic resilience of people struggling on purpose. The goal is not people suffering. But, if anything, I do feel like there's a lot to be learned from communities of color who have long had to advocate for radical change because their survival demanded it. And so I've leaned in with being mixed and the paradox and struggles of that and hope that talking about them honestly will create the sort of discomfort that inspires people to act.

Absolutely. Speaking of the goal not being suffering, can you speak to the importance of imagination in climate justice, as well as your personal mental health care (which as we're saying is really one and the same)?

I talk a bit about radical imagination at the end of the book, and I feel like sometimes people think that imaginative practices are on par with being a little bit unrealistic or having your head buried in the sand. And it’s not entirely that. Radical imagination is the belief that we deserve better. It's almost like a map for how we get there. With imaginative practices, we can imagine a world where literally all of us are thriving, are more liberated, are not suffering from the impacts of the climate crisis, whether that be on your mental, physical, or spiritual well-being.

Imagination is one of the few things that keeps me going in this space because when you feel like you're losing hope, you can tap back into, “OK, well, what could this world look like?” And I truly do believe that anything less than that is not worth our time.

So beautiful. While working on this book did you witness or grapple with any injustices within the publishing industry?

Oh yeah. In America, you guys have AAPI, in the U.K. we use ESEA (East and Southeast Asian) because a lot of our communities are made up of immigrants with a very specific experience. I was very fortunate to have an incredible team of ESEA women who were working on this project with me. My book editor, Kaiya Shang, she's also mixed European and Asian, and then Viv [Yau], who's British-born Chinese. We are really lucky to have worked together, and that's a rarity. I really don't think most people have that experience in part because there aren't actually that many ESEA people in publishing.

Among your many roles, you also co-founded the Bad Activist Collective. And in your conversation at The New York Times Climate Hub, you spoke about the importance of dismantling the idea of perfectionism in the environmental movement. Will you speak more on what it means to live life as a bad activist? 

It really goes back to the ethos of “it's not just you,” which is that no one person is responsible for this crisis, and no one person has all the solutions to fixing it.

This perfectionist narrative is actually not doing anybody any favors because it not only holds people to really high standards that alienate the majority of people who may not necessarily be able to act in a certain way, but it also isn't how the climate crisis has come about. It's a very big systemic thing. And I feel like if we continue to individualize these narratives, we're not actually gonna find the solutions that we need. For me in particular, as I've been doing this work for a while now and had more opportunities to be in public forums, I've noticed the nitpicking is just incessant. And I think to myself, “Why do we spend so much energy trying to fight people who are just trying to do their best?” We can't be perfect in an imperfect world. Why don't we turn that energy toward the solutions instead of tearing each other down?

This community also needs strength in numbers. I try to focus more on community efforts than the individualistic perspective. 

A large part of this book is about the necessity of taking care of yourself before you can take care of others and the planet. So what are you getting up to lately to heal and take time for yourself? 

I'm gonna be real transparent. I've not been the best at doing that lately, so maybe this is a little space for me to be accountable. And I think that's important. You know, like doing a check-in every so often.

Something that I really need to do is a full-on digital detox. This work is grueling mentally and physically, emotionally. But. Constantly being glued to a screen as I am a lot of the time, ’cause I work internationally, I just don't think it's very good for the mind and the soul.

I'm gonna use this as a call to accountability for me to get outside and actually spend time in the world that I'm trying to fight for because at the end of the day, connection is super important, right? And if you feel no connection to what you're trying to fight for, then maybe it's time to reassess, you know?

Something that also really helps — I love to read. For me, reading is almost like a little act of resistance, a silent meditation in many ways. I need to start reading some more fiction, because that's where the imagination comes in. I wrote a non-fiction book (no hate to people who write non-fiction!) but sometimes all you need is to escape into another reality, you know? So I'm gonna try and do that in the next couple of days.

Get a fantasy trilogy in there for sure. Well, thank you so much, Tori! It was really great to get to read through this book and to have you here at Mixed Asian Media. 

I'm really excited to see this platform exist! Never in a million years did I think there are people who looked like me doing this kind of cool stuff. I'm actually super excited as well ’cause I'm doing a book launch event in London with one of my good friends who’s actually an actor, and she's half-Chinese, half-English. Her name's Jessie Mei Li and she was in the Netflix series, Shadow and Bone. 

Ohhhhhhh yeah. Maaaassive fan! 

Yeah! So I feel like I had Kaiya, my book editor, Viv, my manager, and now Jessie doing this [event] with me. I just feel unbelievably blessed. 

This is the community, right? Congratulations again and thank you for the work you do, I hope the event is amazing!

Thank you!

You can buy It’s Not Just You now (with U.S. delivery from Blackwells Bookshop)!